CTC Ep. 55 | How To Sign High Ticket Clients Consistently With Fope “Fopsy” Nkwocha

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Speaker: Welcome to from Click to Client, where we transform a confusing message into a clear, compelling story that sells. I'm your host, Chris Jones, StoryBrand marketing expert. I'm here to help you attract more dream clients with the power of story.

Fopsy, welcome to the podcast today. It is such a delight to have you here and I'm excited to dive into your brilliance and hear what you have to share. So, tell us a little bit about yourself and what you do.

Fopsy: Thank you, Kris. So glad to be here.

It's been a long, long time coming, so thank you for having me. Hi everyone listening. I am Fope, AKA Fopsy. I'm a business coach who primarily works with service providers and their sales, so I work with coaches, consultants, creators, who already know what to do, but they struggle to do it consistently. Most of my clients have great offers and real talent, but they're stuck in the.

What I like to call the execution gap. They're busy but not necessarily moving the needle in their business. They're posting online, tweaking their websites a little bit, but like income is up [00:01:00] and down. And so what I do with my clients is to help them simplify their business and focus on what I like to call money making priorities.

So their offer, their leads, their sales process, their mindsets, and their execution habits, which is really. Um, how, what you do every single day that adds up. Um, I do this primarily within a 12 week container, and we turn the overwhelm into consistent action that helps you sign at least five new high ticket care clients during that time.

So the heart of my work really is helping brilliant service providers finally get paid and get paid consistently for what they're already great at by building the focus, confidence and systems to do it. And before all this work, I used to work in marketing for larger corporations. I did Google, I worked as startups.

And um, my story into entrepreneurship is, was one born through layoffs? Um, but I'm back to work now and still doing this 'cause I still believe that one source of income is too close to zero. But that's a story for another day. But anyways, it's lovely to be here

Kris: today. Ah, I'm so happy that you're here.

Did I hear you say that you guarantee that they're gonna sign five clients before that [00:02:00] 12 week container ends?

Speaker 2: That's how I work together to help you sign five new high to care clients if you, if you have the work together essentially. And if you don't, we'll do it again for another 12 weeks and before you leave me, you'll get a return on your investment with at least five new high to care clients.

Yes.

Speaker: That is so fantastic. I love that. I love that. Thank you. I think a lot of, um. I mean, there's so many variables when it comes to marketing that I think, uh, it's hard to make a guarantee like that. And I think it really just says a lot about the, the quality of the work that you do, and to your point, focusing on those money making activities.

So tell me more about that. Like, I, I really resonate with what you're, what you shared around. As entrepreneurs, we can be busy all the time, but are we actually working on the things that are gonna move the needle for our business? 'cause sometimes we avoid those things or those things get pushed lower on the list and we end up, you know, being productive, but not necessarily [00:03:00] productive with the things that really need our attention.

So tell me more about that.

Speaker 2: Okay, so when I talk about moneymaking priorities, I think it's a lot about helping. Service providers see that you likely don't need more strategy, you need more execution. So most service providers have a general sense of direction of like, okay, this is what my business is doing.

They know they need more clients. They feel like they, they need to get their offers in front of more people. But you know these things. But are you doing them and are you doing them consistently? Because until you start doing them, you don't have your own data on like, this is what I did. That worked, this is what I should do more of.

I was listening to one of your podcasts, Kris, and you talked about how you changed your button from money making. So from to money making messaging call. Yes. I can't remember what it was before. Yeah. It was a,

Speaker: a clarity from a clarity call to a money making messaging call.

Speaker 2: Yep. And you saw a difference in that.

Yeah. That's not stuff you read in a book. You just knew because you did it and you saw results on this. And I, I believe that most of us are in reading, in listening to podcasts, even this one, we are trying to find the best practices, but like it's best practices for them. Or best practices as in get the [00:04:00] principle from there, but don't necessarily try to fit yourself into that mode per se.

So if you don't get your own data by executing, if you don't put in, put your offer in front of more people, you don't know if it's an offer that's a problem, or if it's that you don't have enough leads. And so I'd rather you in our work together, get you to. Make more people, make more offers. Come back to me with the data you've gotten or not, or the results you've not gotten, and then we know what to, what to change based on that as opposed to you just buying a new course, doing a new thing, which is kind of a big thing for service providers.

We love to learn, and I think the reason we love to learn is because learning simulates. Motion. It feels like we're moving, but like you're not really moving forward if you're just observing that information until you've applied it and you've seen the results or lack thereof, you don't really know what is working.

So when making priorities looks like every single week, we, um, well first of all, I built this based on the principles of the 12 week year. I read that book and I learned a lot about like lead indicators and lagging indicators and clients, which is the core thing my people want. I lag indicator because it's like weight loss, for example, you wanna lose 20 pounds.

20 pounds is what happens after you've consistently done the eating right, the moving, the sleeping more. [00:05:00] All those things that are boring but needed to do. So you keep thinking, I need to lose 20 pounds. I'm gonna measure this if I lost 20 pounds. And like, you're not doing those things or you're not excited about those things.

Or measuring how much or how well those things you're doing. So in the world of getting clients, it's thinking. Have, I know my offer done, how many leads am I getting? And leads is not just generating content, like, um, leads come from outreach content and ads like, so essentially things that have you.

Missing more people, making more friends, they're uncomfortable. I think you talked about that a little bit before. They're uncomfortable because it feels like, okay, what if they say no? Then that's data and you know that that's not working. So there's different pieces. If you're launching, it looks like getting people to come to your event.

If you are, um, getting people coming to your wall, but you're not closing, that means your money, making priorities, getting better at sales calls so that you can close them. And like, so it depends on who I'm working with, but I, but generally they fall into. Your offer, your leads, your sales process, your mindset, and your weekly execution habits.

And then if you've grown and you have a team, it's also around your team and what you're doing or not doing to help your business make money.

Speaker: Yeah. Mm. There there's so many components to it, and I think a lot of it is, like you said, mindset and [00:06:00] the psychology behind it, and so often. As business owners and service providers, we create something.

And I think as entrepreneurs we like to create. We like to feel that motion, and sometimes we jump ship on a great idea because we haven't put in an. In front of enough people to get the data and we're like, it's very much like that. That whole, like if you build it, they will come, you know, with, with a website.

I think people feel like that a lot or with an offer if I design this offer, yeah. You know, people will come, but. There is, um, there, there, the, one of the most important things that you can do is that outreach. Like how can you get this in front of enough people so then you can get the data that you need to decide?

Is it working, is it not? What about it is working? What about it isn't working? And really refining and tweak and it takes. A lot of patience and, and, and many times a lot of discomfort. Um, because [00:07:00] if you don't put it in front of people, um. You can make this assumption that okay, it's not working, but in a way that's less, uh, that's more comfortable, right?

That keeps you in kind of outside of visibility and it keeps you. Kind of head down working. Yeah. Instead of really getting out there and becoming visible and really making the difference that, you know, and that we all wanna make. Right.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Two things you said that I kinda wanna like pig piggyback off and I, I, I'll note then to the first was that we like to create things as service providers.

And I guess in a bit of a vulnerable moment this year, one of the things I did was I created a. New offer. I called it done in 90. I just created it because I had been guessing the same objection on my sales calls about money. And I just thought, okay, I need something smaller to sell to people. But that's like, that was my interpretation of that piece of data.

The real thing was that I needed to get better at answering that question of like, of like, why is this worth what it's worth? And my coach had told me, you need more leads. You need to like get, get in the practice of doing this. You need to also work on your sales calls. I just, I didn't believe it [00:08:00] or I just thought, it's something else.

It must be the offer. And so I did that and eventually I, I came to my, I guess I came to my senses because one person bought and I was like, actually, I don't want to deliver this. So I, I in refunded them and I thought, okay, the thing I really wanna sell at the price I wanna sell is my 1 0 1 coaching. So let me go figure out what's wrong here.

I did finally go get more leads. I watched hours and hours of like my own sales calls and got better at it. So stopped freezing at the like question of like, okay, why does it cost this much? How long? It's like all of that. And also just learned how to do it better. And last month I had a hundred percent close, close cohort after months of like working on it.

So like it's, it's also just the learning of I wasted time. Like I spent the better parts of this year believing it was my offer and just like not taking the coaching I was getting. Right. So it's not that like. It's not just like beginners or whatever, it's still something you have to watch for, to be like, okay, am I creating stuff in an echo chamber where it's just me thinking about it?

Or I think I've also heard, heard you say that like most of us are good at doing these things for other people, not so much ourselves, and like, so get the help you need. And take the advice essentially. Yeah. So that that was the [00:09:00] best thing. Yeah,

Speaker: it really does. I talk a lot about that bottle effect, which is really, as self-employed people, we are inside the bottle trying to read the label.

That can only be read from outside the label, and that's why you need a coach or a mentor to come in and read your label for you with a fresh eyes, fresh perspective. And no one is immune from this. Yeah. It doesn't matter if you're in the industry, it doesn't matter if you've been doing this. Yeah. A long time.

We all need our own coaches and mentors Absolutely. To come in and give us guidance. So I think the million dollar question here is, well, couple things. I wanna dive into sales calls 'cause that can often be a, a weak link. I had a conversation with a client this morning that. You know, she has been refining, tweaking, and getting her page really dialed in, getting her offer dialed in, getting her call to action dialed in, and sure enough, she is getting people signing up for calls.

Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: And then she shared with me that she is not. Confident in how she is navigating these sales calls [00:10:00] and she's getting ghosted essentially. She's not converting any of those sales calls, and within my offer and program, I have sales call training. I have gone through my own self sales call training with one of the best.

In the industry she is in, um, in Australia. And she worked with me for week after week analyzing my transcripts and refining and tweaking my calls. And I kept, I kept working it and learning just like you did, you know, analyzing those calls and figuring out where is the weak link. 'cause I don't care if your offer is gold.

Yeah. Or if you're. Website is gold. If you can't get on the call and bring those potential clients and turn them into clients, then it doesn't matter how good everything else is.

Speaker 2: It's also just heart breaking. 'cause you spend all that time. Yes. And money getting someone to the call, like Yes. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. It truly is.

So tell me, what did you learn from analyzing your own sales calls?

Speaker 2: Okay, [00:11:00] so I have to shout out my own co-chair, Dale Sharon. She's excellent, great sales coach. Um, she has a simple process that works through triage treatment plan. Tell the author it's a three step process, but also doesn't, doesn't force you to do a script which can have you.

A bit rigid and not like yourself.

Speaker 3: Yeah.

Speaker 2: Um, but what I learned from my sales calls was I was talking too much.

Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2: Yeah. I was talking too much. My, your job on the sales call is to ask questions and learn from the person what they need and. I was just like, I think I was getting too much into coach mode.

Yeah. Like that as though it was a coaching call, and it's not a coaching call because it's a sales relationship at that point, not a coaching relationship. So I learned to ask better questions that weren't just open-ended for the sake of asking questions, but questions that helped me to understand the urgency of this for them.

Questions that help me to understand the, the, their feelings around the problem and it not being solved or it being solved, and. What would like the stakes, essentially, what would be different or better or worse if they were to act on this in, um, [00:12:00] in the next like three months, six months? Like just around like what's urgent now?

Why is it important and what, what is at stake if nothing changes, like those kinds of questions. And so previously I was asking questions, but I just asked questions because, you know, I know to ask questions, so I didn't think of what, what am I actually looking for with my questions? So the questions were just all over the place.

So again, you don't know this in the beginning. And then, um, also to. Tie back, whatever. 'cause my offer is one-on-one and it's all customized. Even when it's not one-on-one. You should be able to talk about the benefit of your offer in a way that's related to what you've heard from the person. Not just like, I'm like, it has, I'm doing all these emotions that I have to explain 'cause this is the podcast.

Okay. So if someone is telling you that they want a, they want, okay, give me an example from your world. What's what? What do people want when they come to get a website done?

Speaker: Oh, I mean, they want it to do this selling for them. They want it, they want the website to get them more clients. They've got, they wanna become more profitable, they wanna make more money.

They want to stop the [00:13:00] grind of like posting every day, and they just want their marketing tools to work for them on auto, on autopilot so they can focus more on the work that they love to do.

Speaker 2: So if you've heard all of that working on autopilot, doing the, taking out the grind, and you're not putting those into what the result of your offer would be, you're missing out.

If you're saying more like, I'm gonna get you a website, it'll be beautiful. It will tell your story. In fact, they'll use StoryBrand Principles, principles. They said nothing about those. They might not even care the principles. Just tell them what they said they want. It would tell it, it would. I, I'm gonna work on your website in such a way that.

People, the land will instantly know what you're selling and they're going to want to buy it would, and that means that instead of spending hours grinding on social media, once, once people come to your, to your website, they know exactly what you're, what you're selling and how it benefits them. And that saves you so much time.

So you don't have, you don't need to spend it grinding like you're mirroring back their words to them. I was missing all of that.

Speaker 3: Yeah.

Speaker 2: And then the final part was. I, I wasn't good at like digging for more questions if I had an objection. I just kinda like thought, okay, well. [00:14:00] I guess that's the end of like, okay, if they book this call with me.

I also have a transparent process where when you book a call, you know my prices, you know, the payment plan, like it's all there. So like it's not a shock. So you book this call knowing all of that, meaning you really wanted to work with me, so I'm doing you a disservice to not answer the questions that you have about, um, my offer.

And I've also learned that objections are just questions. They just want answers. So like that was all of it. There was so much there. Um, and I also, now I'm not, I'm not too proud. Every time I have a sales call, I go re relearn. Like, I just go refresh my learning so I don't feel like so, so much time is fast and I'm excited about them now.

I don't like feel that, oh my God is, is gonna happen or not. So because, and I realize that, okay, this is a good one. It's a skill problem. It's not a youth thing, it's just a skill that you haven't mastered yet. If it's lead generation, if it's sales calls, if it's even client delivery to an extent. So it doesn't feel heavy.

You just need to build the skill. You need to go figure out people that have learned the skill well and learn from them, and at some point it will feel like driving. You don't have to like struggle so much to drive anymore once you figure it out because you just do it. So yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah, I agree with you on, on the script thing.

What I do is what I, I call it a flow, right? [00:15:00] It's a sequence of like the way the call should flow, and what I'm hearing from you is that you begin to position yourself as the guide instead of the hero, right? You took charge and every question had purpose, and so like when I do my calls.

First we take the time to connect and we uncover like what are they struggling with? And I take notes on that. And then of course we talk about what do they ultimately want? Like do they really want more profits or do they really just want more free time? Do they actually wanna work less? I mean, what do they really want?

Yeah. And then all I do is echo that back to them. I say, here's what I hear you, here's what I hear you telling me. So you, and then I list their problem and I share like their hopes and dreams. Yes. And. It felt kind of funky the first time I did that. 'cause I thought, is this gonna sound weird? But let me tell you, time and time again, I have clients saying, wow, after that call, I really feel like you heard me.

Like you really listened to me. This was not, nobody wants to get on a sales call and get sold [00:16:00] to. They want to feel a connection and they want you to hear, listen, and understand them. And. I changed my mindset around this, um, in two ways. Number one, I look at the call as. I'm just here to help you make the right decision for you.

And if I, if we get to a no and it's a no for you, yeah, that's a win for me. 'cause I've helped you come to a, a decision one way or the other. If it, if it ends up being a good fit and it's a yes. Wonderful. That's great. Then we'll move on to the next step. But one thing I was doing a lot in, in the earlier days, um, prior to working with this coach was I would.

They would be onboard. Yeah. I totally am interested. I think this would be great. And I would say, okay, um, I'm gonna shoot you an email, uh, later today with a link where you can pay. And then I would never hear from them again. And so she goes, she watched me do this on these transcripts. And she goes, um, why are you not taking payment on the call?

Speaker 3: And I was

Speaker: like, well. [00:17:00] That would be awkward and forward. And she's like, no, if they wanna work with you, like how are you gonna get them the results that they're looking for? And you know you can get them, how are they gonna get that if they don't engage with you and work with you? And I was like. Yeah,

Speaker 3: yeah,

Speaker: that's true.

And so then I would say, okay, great. It, this is, this is the, in the investment. Um, I'll go ahead and take payment right here. And it completely shifted my close rate because. People were ready. They also like appreciated that they didn't have to figure out the next step alone that I

Speaker 2: Leadership.

Speaker: Yeah, I'm gonna hold their hand.

I've got them. Not only, you know, do you not have to click on a link and fill in in for your information? I'm gonna actually do it for you, which is the type of experience I want my clients to have. From the minute they make the investment to the minute our engagement is complete and it, it's all representative of what it's gonna be like to work with you.

Yeah,

Speaker 2: and I think a couple patterns, you're like [00:18:00] similar threads in my world as well, is the belief that I can help you. Because if you don't believe that, you might be nervous to echo their words back to them. And echoing is really important because it's literally, if you change it, if you're too expert speaky, if you're like trying to polish it, you're going to lose them a little bit.

'cause it's they, they want to hear that you can solve my exact problem. So like very important. But yeah, the mindset piece about believing that you really can help this person in front of you. Like, either you know what to do or you can workshop it. It's like really important to hold. Um, and in similar vein, I don't take permit on the call, but I give a deadline.

I ask for decisions within 48 hours. So that also means that I'm not waiting forever. Like I just know. And I tell them that upfront on the call so they know. I also ask them which option they're looking to go with, and I can, I think now I, I began to sense. Like, there's also something called a false Yes.

People like that. And maybe that's something that your world might, um, like your approach might deal with where someone might say yes on the call and then like change their minds or whatever. And in, in that case, honestly. Like you said, right? I feel sufficient in myself. Like I'm grateful that I like my needs are met all is well.

They might come back or they might even send people your way. I've had people [00:19:00] who have said no, but then they sent three people my way. I'm like,

Speaker 3: okay,

Speaker 2: thank you. So something was good about the experience enough to, to come back. So it's all there.

Speaker: Yeah. I thought you brought up a really good point about like, let's reframe objections to just questions that people have.

One of the things that I do. Toward the end of the call, once I've kind of walked them through how I work with my clients, I have one offer. Uh, anytime I try and make a second offer, I like remove it because one offer is all I want. Yeah. Right now. Um, and it, it helps keep my business simple. So after I've walked them through my offer, I asked them, okay, on a scale of one to 10.

How much does this really resonate with you? Like are you at a. Two or one being, Nope, this is not what I need. 10 being yes, no brainer. This is like exactly what, what I need. So I let them like decide that themselves. Um, and then if they're an eight yeah. Or a nine, or they're a five, whatever they are, um, I say, okay, tell [00:20:00] me what's keeping you from being at a 10.

Speaker 3: Yes.

Speaker: And then that allows me to uncover those objections. And if they're legitimate objections, then, you know, I, we talk through it. Um, but if there are objections that, um, can be overcome essentially, like in an on honest and ethical way.

Speaker 3: Yeah.

Speaker: Um, you know, if somebody doesn't have the money to invest

Speaker 3: Yeah.

Speaker: That's legitimate. Like, I'm not gonna. You gonna try and change someone's mind around that. But if it's, um, maybe it's something like, and this is, I hear this a lot, you know, I've been burned before I, I joined a program or I bought something. Oh. Imagine how

Speaker 2: it's like for coaches. I hear it a lot too.

Speaker: Oh yeah, totally.

And I, I get it. I mean, it's a leg. It's legitimate. Yeah. And it's like a, a concern might be. I am worried that I'm not gonna get enough one-on-one attention, you know? Mm-hmm. And then I, then I get to reassure them, oh, no, no, no. Like, oh, one-on-one. You so much, so much one-on-one attention. Like, that's why I love the work that I do.

We get, we get to dive in deep. Yeah. So, okay. [00:21:00] So one of the things that you promise is that your clients are gonna get five high ticket clients or sales. By the end of this 12 weeks. So I wanna dive into like that's the million dollar question. How do people get more clients in an effective, efficient way?

Speaker 2: So great question. Um, if it's our very f, if it's our very first time ever selling, the first goal actually is to get a sale, not five clients, if you've never sold anything before. So create an offer and get a sale. And at that, and that's, so our sales score, uh, process creates the plan for the next four weeks.

And you agree to that. So in that case, it's a, so if you've sold before. We, the, the first thing we do is also to look into how you sold before, because I find that for most people, we are not studying our own data enough so that we are not repeating our own successes or documenting them, so we don't even know what we did well and we're surprised at the results.

So that helps a lot because it uncovers. Patterns where you are, areas where you're strong and should be doubling down on. So one of [00:22:00] my, um, clients, there were, there were three co-founders, pharmacy mentors, and their thing was that they were, they were helping people pass their, like Canadian licensing exams for pharmacy exams.

And so when they came to me, they had been doing it in, um, a group, a group format, like having people join their, their group very while and they, they said they wanted to launch to the public and they felt like they needed to scrap everything. Like, and just like find a new process, you know, be ready and marketing properly, build structure.

And I'm like, why are we gonna do that? You have something that's working, you have a process of getting referrals, and then you have a webinar where you tell your story some more and you have such high engagement. I was gonna warn you that I had a doorbell coming up where I have to let my n nieces and nephew in.

Speaker: Oh, it's so good. Oh, I, I, I can edit, so no worries. I'm gonna do a little, one, one second. I'll start

Speaker 2: this through. I don't even know what I just said, but One second.

Speaker: All good.

Speaker 2: All right.[00:23:00]

Speaker: You're on mute. There you go. All right, welcome.

Speaker 2: All right. So, oh, I dunno what I said last time. Oh, yours.

Speaker: Yes,

Speaker 2: you've got good engagements. Why reinvent the wheel? So step during that meant that we, we could beat on it instead of just waiting for referrals from, um.

From people that they knew. We started to talk about what it did on LinkedIn and that attracted even more people. But the process of how we go from how I get to guarantee the offer, um, five clients essentially is we refine their money making offer. So for them, they were saying that they help people pass

their exams. They were saying that they helped pharmacists, but then in digging through in their own experience and people, they were attracting, they were working with internationally trained pharmacists. That's a more specific who. Mm-hmm. And that also ties into why it was so important for them. You're moving to a whole new country.

If you don't get relicensed, you can work. There's a number of, there's a limit to how many times you can retake the exams or you forfeit your profession. Like the stakes are just so much higher. So in, I'm also a huge fan of StoryBrand, by the way, and I use it in my work, so. [00:24:00] In walking through all of that, we got to help them name a border promise of pass your PBC exam on the first track.

That just resonated so much more because wow, like this, it's a whole different world. And then it wasn't just to everybody anymore, it was to internationally trained pharmacists so they could talk about the unique struggles of immigrating to a whole new country of like your family and all of that. That was the first part with the offer and then with leads, we said, okay, we know that.

Referrals are great. We're gonna keep that and we're gonna lay our own content on top of that. So the stuff that you're already doing inside of these groups, you're going to talk about it publicly because it's the proof you have that you haven't really used already. So it's not really new stuff, it's just bringing it out of you.

So we did that and we got them. To use link to funnel people into a webinar, which they were already doing. They had really, really great conversion rates on their webinar because they would tell their own stories of why past questions weren't enough. All of that. I said, we're not throwing that away, we're just getting more people there.

Also, their prices were very, very low. They were charging two 50 for a four month coaching program. I was like, Ooh, that is too small. So, but they had a hard time. Charging more because it was like passion, but also like, oh, these people are just moving. There's so many [00:25:00] expenses. So I got them to do the math.

The math of retakes, the cost of it, the cost and loss income, the um, the, the amount of, um, just like the emotional. Investment into all those process. And then they, they slowly got there. I was like, I want you to get to a four figure price, so that's my standard for you. So it took a while, but we got to 1 2 50.

And so they, they, they, they were, they were happy with that. They said that they first clutched their pills and then when, when they got there in the new world, they got people to come to the webinar and they signed seven new clients at the new price. So how do I get you to sign five new high ticket care clients or refine your offer so that it becomes a money making offer, whether that, that looks like.

Giving, naming the bold, I promise. Whether that looks like, um, helping you to get sold on your off, on your offer so that you're able to sell it. Because if you can't really, if you're like never seeing your price, it's gonna affect how many people you're able to sell into it. We get leads because you need people to sell to it's people.

One metric that I, I guess a concept I need to refine a little bit more is I believe that you'll make much more sales if you have more client facing time. So more time with people as opposed to inside your [00:26:00] business. Or like when I say inside your business, I mean like inside your systems or things that don't get you in front of people.

Then we look at your sales process and make sure you have a sales, we just talked about sales, so like you know all about it, and then we work on your mindset. So you know your thoughts around money, your thoughts about your work, your thoughts about the value of it, your thoughts about yourself and the conditions in your life, even like.

Things, I don't feel like they're related to business, but because we're people who run these businesses, they're related anyways. And then the weekly habits, there were people who did this on the site, so they had full-time jobs and families. So we were layer layering on top of that. Who's doing what, how do we know something is done?

I, I kind of help you keep score as well, like, because I'm your coach and so I. I, the money making priorities are, what did you say you're gonna do last week? Like a number do X by Y, and then did you do it? So all of that ladders into momentum over the 12 weeks. So that's really how I help you to get the clients.

It's not jazz, it's not magic, it's not, it doesn't even sound sexy, but it is. It works because it is built on principles and it requires you to execute.

Speaker 3: Mm-hmm. And

Speaker 2: face off with your lack of execution or your execution and the data you do have, and then we tweak from there.

Speaker: Mm-hmm. You, I love [00:27:00] the point that you made about, like they were charging $250 for, for this.

Um, yeah, I think it's funny. I, I'm working with a client right now and she was charging $250 and she charged it that way. It was like, it was a very valuable, it was a parenting program. Hmm. Um, she's a parenting coach and she solves a really important. Problem. Um, but she felt like, oh, if I off, if I charge less.

More people will, will buy it. And ultimately what can happen a lot is that you devalue your own service. Because if people think she is only charging two 50, then it's not actually gonna move the needle for me, or it's not actually gonna bring me the result. And so. Often if you charge more, like I talked with her and we worked her offer.

We refined her offer. Yeah. And now she's charging 24 97. 2,497. Nice. And we're. Positioning the offer. So it feels a lot more [00:28:00] valuable Yes. For people. Um, even though like the value of it hasn't dramatically changed, but people are gonna show up differently as well. If I'm paying more for a, a program, I have more skin in the game.

Yeah. I'm more likely to actually. Take the guidance given and I'm more likely to get the results. So you actually, when you raise your prices like that, you're actually doing a favor to your clients because they're more likely to get the results when they have more skin in the game.

Speaker 2: Yes, and it's even, even when you raise your prices, sometimes it forces you to face off with.

Um, other factors. So I have another client who's a career coach and her thing was, uh, therapy is just too, she works, she works with people who've been laid off to heal from the layoff and then like, get a next gig. I just. Convince her to add that, get their next gig because she was like, the healing is more important.

I'm like, you won't be all the way healed until you get a job. Like it's gonna keep coming back with financial stress is a thing. So we worked on that. Um, but the big thing was she would, she was telling me that like most people get, tend to get their jobs in four to six months. But then her program before meeting me was three months.

I'm like, okay, so [00:29:00] why is your program three months if people get it in four to six months? So it's not just raising your practice in isolation, it's also looking at like the holistic offer. Yeah. The container. Making sure that you're providing support to help them get those results that you promise. And even giving buffer for failure, people who struggle, right?

And like making sure that you really are taking care of your people holistically and you don't resent your clients. For all that work when you're paid properly for it already. So there's all of that as well happening.

Speaker: Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. I think that, um. There's a lot that goes into the timeline of things like what do you know, what kind of timeline do your clients need in order to get to that end result?

And are you gonna stick with them in, in kind of a re reverse scenario, I have a client who was offering a one year program. Mm-hmm. And I wanna say it was like six. Thousand dollars for the a year of support. And she, it was a group program and she decided to change, um, to, to change the offer to a six month program because people felt like a [00:30:00] year, like, it's gonna take me a year to get through all this.

Like I want. I want more immediate success and so she changed it to six month. She has not changed her delivery at all. Like she is, she is, they're still getting what they need in six months and then she basically is telling them at that point, if you wanna know another six months, you can have it for free.

So like, but it's a mindset shift. Like they're like, okay, so interesting. Yeah, I know like the carrot at the end of this is gonna happen in six months, and if it doesn't, then I have the option to continue at no charge.

Speaker 2: Yeah. One person that's coming to mind as you described that is, I guess. It's related, but, so it's a product coach.

She helps people to validate and launch, I forget her exact promise right now, but, um, she had a six week accelerator and it was good for like, validating the idea. Uh, but not everybody would have their prototype by the end of that time because when you're dealing with a physical thing, you know, yeah. It takes time.

All of that.

Speaker 3: Yep.

Speaker 2: So I was like, okay, [00:31:00] why can't you, can the core program accelerator bit be in the six week? Um, spare and then she added on a bit of coaching and then let the entire program be a year so that if they need. The accelerator is there for them to do the validation and all of that and be their wait list.

But then, because you know that you're already offering prolonged support, like she was helping people for free after the container. So why don't you just make it like a year long thing? Yeah. So like there's space for you to offer that additional support, but you still promise their accelerator, which gets the job done.

And people, like you're saying, don't feel like, oh my God, this is gonna take a whole year for me to do this, but they know that if it does, if I do need support with other things during that year s to this thing, I have it. So. Very interesting. There's a lot of nuances around it. And pricing isn't just like a, a one price bid all, I guess.

Speaker: Right. And if, you know, if your timeline is shorter, it doesn't mean you have to charge less. Right? Yeah. Yeah. So maybe 12 week. Yeah. Let's, let's dive into the 12 week sprint that you talk about. I've read that book. It's called the 12 week year. Is that what it's. Called? Yeah, it is. It totally blew my mind. I like ended up buying some like Canva [00:32:00] planners around the 12 week year and it, it really resonated with me and I think it makes a lot of sense with the way humans operate, but for people that aren't familiar with it, like Phyllis and what is it?

And tell us how you use it.

Speaker 2: Okay. So I think the core. Ethos slash gist of the book is that if we, the reason why we wake up every New Year's Day and we have resolutions is that it's like a natural reset in time and we feel like, okay, um, I need to, like a new page has turned, I need to do these new things and.

When the end of the year is coming, there's a natural urgency because you feel like the year is about to end. All these goals are set for myself, whether that's as an individual or as a business. There's so many sales during the end of the year because people finally realize that the period is set for themself is coming to an end.

And so the, the, the end, the entire point is saying that like instead of waiting for an entire year to have that urgency, what if you allowed. Every week to be the equivalent, equivalent [00:33:00] of a month, and you give yourself 12 weeks for your goal. But then during that time you are focused on execution, owning your goal, and measuring your input.

So if you have a goal, don't just say, oh, I have 12 months, or I have 12 weeks. Like every single week you decide if my goal is to. Is to, um, get clients. How many more leads do I have? Like, do I, what's a lead? Is it a name? And, and somebody I can contact an email. So then you measure that, that you have something you measure.

So it's also about tracking and having, knowing that. The outputs we want comes from a bunch of input. And so since we don't really get to control the output, we get to control our input, put our attention on focusing on that input. And, um, well, that means that you need to, first of all, figure out if you have the right input.

And once you do, just measure that and score yourself against. What did I do? How much of it did I do? And if you achieve 85% of the, say, if you wanted to go to get 10 leads every week and you get at least 8.5, which you can, so eight or nine, then you've, you've done good, right? If you [00:34:00] did six and you keep doing 6, 5, 4 week after week, it's not a mystery that you might not get to your goal because you're not.

Being, you're not keeping your promises to yourself in the moment. And so it also helps you to just like, have radical accountability for yourself. It helps you to see that so much of what we want is, is about keeping our promises to ourselves and, um, being around making sure that we have the right inputs in the first place.

So that also means that. Your life feels a bit, a bit. The things you can control, you control. I mean, there's things you can't control in life, but the ones you can control, weight loss, um, whether you go on a marathon, whether you go on a trip and you save forest, whether you get the clients you want, you control it.

So how I use it, um, I use it loosely, but I like that we have 12 weeks as a deadline. It creates that natural sense of urgency there. Um, and then it forces us to focus on what are we doing like, and how much of it are we doing every single week. So you would just say. I want to have a webinar. Okay, what date is it?

How many leads do you need to get to come to it? What are you going to do between when they sign up and when the webinar comes? Like your emails, what are they gonna look like? What are you gonna say in those emails? It helps us, it forces us to get into the nitty [00:35:00] gritty and then to evaluate them on how much are we doing and how well are we doing it?

Um, so yeah. Mm-hmm.

Speaker: I think there's also a real truth in, in humans, we feel very disconnected. From who we're gonna, who we are a year from now.

Speaker 3: Yeah. We

Speaker: feel very connected with who, who we are a month from now, or three months from now. Yeah. And so it's this ability to kind of reign in our connection with our own self and kind of work in this like micro microbubble and then reset.

And what a gift, you know, what a gift to kind of, after 12 weeks go, okay, now what I'm gonna focus on.

Speaker 2: And, and it forces you to make goals that are like. Yes, ambitious, but also rightsized to the time you have so that you don't create this massive thing that feels insurmountable. I think the bigger thing also is because 12 weeks is short, if you really don't teach your goals, you have three more 12 weeks to go in the same year rather than waiting, uh, the whole 12 months to find that out.

So if it allows you to iterate faster, and I love the part about getting data [00:36:00] faster as well, so Yeah. Yeah, totally.

Speaker: So tell me, what are the what? What's the one thing that keeps service providers stuck when it comes to growing their business?

Speaker 2: Just

Speaker: one thing. Or three? You, I'm just kidding. Gimme more. I know there's a lot.

A dozen. Okay. I

Speaker 2: think that one of them is that. We love new things, especially when it comes to marketing. We love the new and, um, I feel like I have to borrow Alex Mo's framework of for this one, and it's like there's more, better, new and we should most of the time start we doing more of what works. For example, if you're trying to get more leads and you want to focus on social media to do that, maybe do more of the posts on LinkedIn and like after a while, look at your data to see which ones are.

Resonating and then do now. Now you know what is better, do more, what's better before you add new, a new platform, a new thing, ads or whatever, but mm-hmm. Because we love to learn. I find that we love new, [00:37:00] we love to figure out this is the one thing that's gonna fix your launches. This is the one thing that's gonna fix your emails.

And so we buy, we spend time learning. We listen to podcasts where they say, this is how I made a million dollars. This is how I made my next. Like, so that is very attractive. So focus is really hard because. New is attractive and pulls at our attention. So the biggest thing that keeps service providers stuck is, I would say, is the chasing of the new.

But also maybe for me, I just think about my own life. 'cause I was, whenever I think of this examples, I like to remember that my ideal clients are also very smart people and they just know, they, they, it's not just that they know. Like they know what to do. Yes, that's another one. You know what to do, but you're not doing it.

So knowing what to do isn't enough. So now you know what to do. Now you know what, what you need to do more of, but are you doing it? So if you haven't done it, the results aren't gonna magically appear. That's one I still fall for and I have to like challenge myself to, to, to do better on. So, yeah. Um.

Things that help with that. Uh, for me, I like deadlines. I give myself deadlines to do things. Um, it's why I have like a, a legion event called the Lead Sprint, which I help people to get leads in that time. And I like it because, because I know the date is coming, I've announced [00:38:00] it. I must do all those things towards it.

So that helps me. Um. How my brain works. I even did things like the first time I did it, I was in the airport and I gave myself an hour between when I was gonna board to like get my page out, send it like it could be, it didn't have to be perfect. It just has to be done. So, right. That's another, I guess if you know how your brain works and work, work with it.

Yeah. Um, and also get help when you need help to, um, fix your blind spots if you will.

Speaker: Totally, totally. I, I was, uh, meeting a few friends for lunch the other day and I had a video that I needed to record and I had to leave in like 15 minutes and I'm like, you know what? I'm gonna record this video 'cause I knew I had this short period of time.

Mm-hmm. And I knew if I challenged myself with that, I would not overthink it. I wouldn't rerecord it. I wouldn't like, try and make it perfect. I recorded the damn thing and went to lunch and it was done. And, um, it's great when you kind of get to know yourself and are able to kind of work with your own.[00:39:00]

Tendency to, uh, procrastinate. I'm talking about my own self.

Speaker 3: Yeah.

Speaker: And, um, and then, you know, work around that a little bit. So, um, Fopsy, this has been so wonderful and chockfull of so much information and insights. Tell my listeners where we can find you.

Speaker 2: So if you're listening, first of all, it's been really great chatting with you and I'm like, this is so fun.

It feels like we've known each other for a while. I love that. It was very conversational. Those are my favorite types of podcasts to listen to. So me too, love it. And I think I'm gonna listen back and people are gonna love it as well. Yeah. Thank you for having me. So if you're listening and you're a service provider, a coach or a consultant or a creative who's tired of like the good months and the bad months.

You don't need another course, another strategy, another viral post. You need structure, you need focus, you need execution. And that's what we work on together instead of my one-on-one coaching money making priorities. So in 12 weeks we'll clarify your offer, then we'll also help you generate leads, build a sales process that helps you sign at least five new high to get clients.

Um, and. First, you can start by joining my next lead sprint. Actually, that's where we'll help you [00:40:00] get more leads in five days flat. And it's free. So the link will be in the description. It's also on my website@fsy.ca. Fsy is spelled FO psy.ca. But if you are like, okay, I wanna skip that and actually just work with you one-on-one, um, you should head that to Fopsy.ca/call to book a sales call.

It's an hour dedicated to your business, identifying your top money, making priorities. And mapping out your own plan over the, for the next 12 weeks. We do it right on the call, by the way. So it's pretty fun to do it together. So every, all roads leads to my website, fopsy.ca. Looking forward to chatting with you soon.

Speaker: Awesome. Well, thank you again and This was so much fun.

Kris: Is your website turning away Potential clients? I can help you turn that around. Book a moneymaking messaging call with me today and we'll transform your story into your most powerful sales tool. That's all for this episode of From Click to Client. Don't forget to subscribe and follow. I'm Chris Jones and I'll see you next.